The Evolution of All-American Terrorism – Reveal

Reveal transcripts are produced by a third-party transcription service and may contain errors. Please be aware that the official record for Reveal's radio stories is the audio.

Al Letson: Hey, hey, hey. It's Al, and I have some exciting news. Okay, so in July, we brought you American Rehab. That was our eight-episode series that uncovered tens of thousands of people desperately in need of help for their addictions, but instead of getting treatment, they were sent to work without pay, sometimes at big corporations. The New Yorker called it riveting, urgent, and mind-bending. Now we're making it available for your binging pleasure. You can find it by subscribing to Reveal Presents: American Rehab wherever you get your podcasts. Again, that's Reveal Presents: American Rehab. All right, get to binging.

Speaker 2: Why did an American family leave behind a comfortable life in Indiana and wind up at the heart of the ISIS caliphate in war-torn Syria? Join the worldwide search to unravel this family's complicated journey and explore what happens as they return to the U.S. Listen to I'm Not a Monster, a new podcast from Frontline, BBC Panorama, and BBC Sounds. Search for the show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

Speaker 2: Reveal is brought to you by Progressive, one of the country's leading providers of auto insurance. With Progressive's Name Your Price tool, you say what kind of coverage you're looking for and how much you want to pay, and Progressive will help you find options that fit within your budget. Use the Name Your Price tool and start an online quote today at progressive.com. Price and coverage match limited by state law.

Al Letson: From the Center for Investigative Reporting and PRX, this is Reveal. I'm Al Letson. The morning of January 6, before the storming of the halls of Congress, reporter David Neiwert tweeted a prediction, "Today is likely to be a historically violent day in the nation's capital."

David Neiwert: Yeah. No, that wound up being an understatement, didn't it?

Al Letson: David wasn't surprised that pro-Trump extremists did what they did. In fact, he linked to a video from the night before shot on the streets of D.C. in which a middle-aged white man in a Trump hat tells a young white nationalist livestreamer-

Speaker 4: In fact, tomorrow, I don't even like to say because I'll be arrested-

Speaker 5: Well, let's not say it.

Speaker 4: I'll say it.

Speaker 5: All right.

Speaker 4: We need to go into the Capitol.

Speaker 5: Let's go!

David Neiwert: It certainly wasn't a surprise for any of the people who've been reporting on and researching the radical right here in the United States in the past year, because they've been pretty upfront about it. They were saying they were going to do this.

Al Letson: David has been following the radical right for decades. A few years back, he and the nonprofit newsroom Type Investigations teamed up with Reveal to start tracking what looked to him like an uptick in far right terrorism. We put together a database of every single domestic terror event starting in 2008.

Al Letson: In 2017, that data showed that right-wing extremists had become the biggest threat, while law enforcement under President Obama was focused on those acting in the name of Islam. Last summer, we ran the numbers for terrorism under President Trump, and we found that far right terror had grown and become more lethal, responsible for almost the same number of deaths during Trump's first three years as during all eight years under Obama. The men, it's almost always men, who are responsible for many of those deaths were driven by the same ideology.

David Neiwert: There's a very specific stripe of white nationalism that we're seeing run through, especially, these more recent mass killings.

Al Letson: Today, we're bringing back a show we first aired last June. We're going to connect the dots to show how extremist ideas and extremist violence spread online, and we'll ask why law enforcement is still struggling to catch up. Reveal reporters Stan Alcorn and Priska Neely dug into this for months. Priska starts us off with the story of a man who witnessed the deadliest domestic terror attack of 2019.

Priska Neely: Guillermo Glenn is well-known in El Paso's Mexican-American community. He's 79 now, and he's been a community organizer and labor rights activist for most of his life.

Guillermo Glenn: We conducted a lot of protests. We blocked a bridge. We went to jail.

Priska Neely: On August 3, 2019, he was just going about his weekend routine.

Guillermo Glenn: It was a Saturday morning around 10:00. I had gone to Walmart to buy some pet food. I was way in the back, and I heard this great big noise.

Priska Neely: A warning, Guillermo is going to share graphic details about what happened that day.

Guillermo Glenn: A large number of families, women and men were running towards me from the front of the building, and then I noticed at least one of the women was dripping blood. I said, "Well, there's something really wrong." I ran into the woman who was... Both her legs had received some type, either shrapnel or bullet wounds, and she was bleeding. So I stopped there to help her, and I grabbed a first-aid kit and tried to at least tend to her wounds in her legs. One of the firemen or paramedic came and told, "You have to get her out. We're getting everybody out of the store." So we put her in one of those grocery baskets.

Priska Neely: When he wheeled the woman to the front, he saw what had happened.

Guillermo Glenn: Right at the front door, there was a lot of blood. I knew then that there'd been a shooter. It was a very traumatic scene. I saw the body of a man with half his head shot off. There was a lady laying on the pavement across from where we're loading the people. I didn't know exactly who he'd taken out. I didn't have that information that he was actually shooting Mexicans.

Priska Neely: The suspected gunman, 21-year-old Patrick Crusius, drove roughly 10 hours from outside Dallas to the El Paso Walmart right near the Mexican border. Police say he opened fire, 23 people were killed and many were wounded, and then he drove off.

Speaker 8: Minutes later, Patrick Crusius stopped his car at an intersection near the Walmart. He came out with his hands raised in the air and stated out loud to the Texas Rangers, "I'm the shooter."

Priska Neely: He's facing 90 federal charges, including 45 hate crimes.

Priska Neely: After Guillermo witnessed what happened that day, he got in his car and went to the restaurant where his friends always gather on Saturdays.

Guillermo Glenn: Several of my friends came up and hugged me and said, "Oh, you're okay. We're so glad. We've been looking for you. We thought you might be there." Then they showed me the manifesto.

Priska Neely: The manifesto. Minutes before the attack, the shooter had posted a document filled with anti-immigrant rhetoric to the online message board 8chan. Some of Guillermo's friends showed him a copy.

Guillermo Glenn: I sat down. I had some food, had some of my regular Saturday menudo. Then I finally realized what had happened, right after I read the manifesto.

Priska Neely: The Crusius manifesto reads kind of like a corporate website. It has an About Me section and parts where he outlines his warped vision for America. He matter-of-factly explains how his attack will preserve a world where white people have the political and economic power. He says peaceful means will no longer achieve his goal.

Priska Neely: Reporter David Neiwert says this alleged shooter is the quintessential Trump-era terrorist, a man largely radicalized online, entrenched in white nationalist ideology, and fueled by the belief that white men like himself are being replaced by Latino immigrants. Crusius wrote that the media would blame President Trump for inspiring him, but he claimed that his ideas predated the Trump campaign. Here's David.

David Neiwert: Patrick Crusius, especially, was so filled with loathing for Latino people that he didn't see them as human.

Priska Neely: When David reads the manifesto, he can immediately see the fingerprints of other white nationalists.

David Neiwert: Here's how Crusius opens his manifesto. "In general, I support the Christchurch shooter and his manifesto. This attack is a response to the Hispanic invasion of Texas. They are the instigators, not me. I am simply defending my country from cultural and ethnic replacement brought on by an invasion."

Priska Neely: That opening line is a direct signal back to a previous act of terrorism, the shooter who killed 51 people at two mosques in Christchurch, New Zealand, just months before. David says this is part of a trend. One terrorist inspires another, and the cycle continues. Guillermo says he didn't understand all of the references at first, but it was clear to him that the manifesto had ties to a larger movement.

Guillermo Glenn: I think he was trying to show that somebody had to take action, and that really angered me at that point. Why would somebody come and shoot innocent people like that?

Priska Neely: David say Crusius started doing online research because of the anger he felt over how the country was changing demographically.

David Neiwert: But in the process of doing this research, he came across multiple white genocide theories, including The Great Replacement.

Priska Neely: The Great Replacement, or replacement theory, unites many acts of hate that we see across the country, around the world.

David Neiwert: That's this idea that comes out of white nationalism that white Europeans face a global genocide at the hands of brown people and that they're being slowly rubbed out of existence.

Priska Neely: Only a few terrorists in recent years have referenced replacement theory by name, but it's widely popular among right-wing extremists. It's linked to ideas that are many decades old, but one attack in Europe showed how those ideas can be weaponized.

David Neiwert: Anders Breivik's terrorism attack in Oslo and Utya Island, Norway, in 2011.

Priska Neely: Breivik killed 77 people in a bombing and mass shooting. Before the attack, he sent out a 1,500-page manifesto about how he planned to lead white supremacists on a crusade against the "Islamification of Europe." Around the same time, a French writer named Renaud Camus refined and popularized the ideology in a book. The title translates to The Great Replacement.

David Neiwert: The Great Replacement essentially is this idea that brown people, particularly refugees and immigrants from Arab countries in Europe, are being deliberately brought into the country in order to replace white people as the chief demographic.

Priska Neely: The conspiracy theory claims all this is orchestrated by a cabal of nefarious globalists. That's code for Jews.

Speaker 9: You will not replace us!

Speaker 10: You will not replace us! You will not replace us! You will not replace us!

Priska Neely: In August 2017, white supremacists in the U.S. took up this concept as a rallying cry at the Unite the Right rally in Charlottesville, Virginia.

Speaker 10: Jews will not replace us! Jews will not replace us!

Priska Neely: The next day, a neo-Nazi drove his car into a crowd and killed 32-year-old Heather Heyer. This incident had an immediate impact on the public perception of terrorism, making it clear that white nationalists violence is a serious threat.

Speaker 11: Today, the nightmare has hit home here in the city of Pittsburgh.

Priska Neely: At a Pittsburgh synagogue in 2018, Robert Bowers is accused of killing 11 people.

David Neiwert: He went to a Jewish synagogue because he was angry about the Latin American caravans. The caravans had been in all the news in the weeks prior to that synagogue attack. He blamed Jews and went to a Jewish synagogue to take revenge for Latino immigration.

Priska Neely: These are the ideologies that are zigzagging across the globe. In March 2019, the gunman who livestreamed his mass shooting in Christchurch, New Zealand, on Facebook also wrote a manifesto. The title, The Great Replacement. The New Zealand manifesto inspired the El Paso shooter to target the people he felt were replacing him. Recent manifestos and books put a new spin on violent, hateful acts, but David traces these sentiments back much further.

David Neiwert: What's remarkable in a lot of ways when I read these manifestos is so many of them are expressing ideas that I read in the 1920s coming from eugenicists. Look, I would even take it back to the 1890s, when we first started seeing the wave of lynchings in the South as a form of social control. This was very clearly a form of terrorism.

Priska Neely: After the El Paso shooting, activist Guillermo Glenn says white supremacist ideology was barely part of the conversation. There were brief efforts to unite the community against hate, a few events held under the banner El Paso Strong.

Guillermo Glenn: The politicians, the businessmen, the mayor, everybody was pushing this idea that we had to survive, but they weren't really talking about who caused it or why.

Priska Neely: Before we talked for this story, Guillermo says he didn't identify as part of this larger group of survivors that includes Jewish and Muslim communities.

Guillermo Glenn: You say, well, it's the Jewish people that they attacked, it's the Muslim people that they attacked, and here on the border it's the Mexican and Central Americans. But nobody talks about, what does the Great Replacement mean? Nobody put all these incidences together and say, "Hey, this is something that we should be aware of nationally."

Priska Neely: And he says that's part of the failure, part of the reason these attacks keep happening.

Al Letson: That story from Reveal's Priska Neely.

Al Letson: As we've been saying, these extremist groups are using online communities to spread their messages and find new recruits. When we come back, we'll hear how it works.

Josh Bates: It's a conditioning process, it's a grooming process, and I let myself fall into that.

Al Letson: The evolution of the white supremacist internet, next on Reveal.

Speaker 2: Thanks to our sponsor NetSuite. If you're a business owner, you don't need us to tell you that running a business is tough. Don't let QuickBooks and spreadsheets slow you down anymore. Now is the time to upgrade to NetSuite by Oracle, the world's number one cloud business system. Let NetSuite show you how they'll benefit your business with a free product tour at netsuite.com/reveal. Schedule your free product tour right now at netsuite.com/reveal.

Al Letson: If you like what we do and you want to help, well, it's pretty simple. Just write us a review on Apple Podcasts. It's easy and only takes a few seconds. Just open the Apple Podcasts app on your phone, search for Reveal, then scroll down to where you see Write a Review. There, tell them how much you love the host. Your review makes it easier for listeners to find us, and well, it really does make a difference. And if you do it, you will get a personal thank you from me right now. Thank, not him, no, you. Yes, you. Thank you so much. Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you. All right.

Al Letson: From the Center for Investigative Reporting and PRX, this is Reveal. I'm Al Letson. We're continuing with our show we first broadcast last summer about domestic terrorism during the Trump administration.

Al Letson: The FBI and academic researchers say there's no such thing as a terrorist profile. You can't tell who's going to become a terrorist with a personality test or a demographic checklist. But the young white men who attacked the synagogues in Pittsburgh and Poway and the Walmart in El Paso, they had a lot in common. Not only were they motivated by the same conspiracy theory about white people being replaced, they developed those ideas in some of the same spaces online. Two of them even posted their manifestos to the same website, 8chan.

Al Letson: Now, you can't blame today's white supremacist terrorism on the internet, but you also can't understand it without talking about the way the white supremacist movement uses the internet and how it's changed over the last decade. Reveal's Stan Alcorn is going to tell that story through the eyes of a man who lived it. Here's Stan.

Stan Alcorn: Josh Bates's decade as a white supremacist started in his mid-20s, with a YouTube video about the presidential candidate he says he supported at the time, Barack Obama.

Josh Bates: I was scrolling through the comments section, "He's a Muslim," "He wasn't born here," things of that nature, and somebody said, "You guys sound like those Stormfront (beep)." I was like, "What in the world is Stormfront?"

Stan Alcorn: Stormfront is a message board that a former KKK leader set up in the '90s. Josh says he went there at first because he was curious, then to argue. But then the middle-aged message-board neo-Nazis started winning him over.

Stan Alcorn: How could they be convincing in these arguments? Can you help me understand that?

Josh Bates: Well, I wish I could answer that question, because I still ask myself that a lot. How could I end up falling for something like that? But I guess it's probably similar to how we look at people who fall into cults. It's a conditioning process, it's a grooming process, and I let myself fall into that.

Stan Alcorn: The experts I talked to say that first step is more about the person than what they're stepping into. Josh had just left the Marines, where he used to have a team and a mission. Now all he had was a computer.

Shannon Martine...: It's pretty concurrent with a whole lot of people, where they felt really deeply disempowered in their lives.

Stan Alcorn: Shannon Martinez is a former white supremacist who's helped people, including Josh, leave the movement.

Shannon Martine...: When you encounter information that's presented that this is the real truth, the true truth people don't want you to have because, if you did, it would be too empowering for you and too disempowering for them, that's an incredibly powerful, toxic drug.

Stan Alcorn: That drug, widely available on the internet, is, at its heart, a conspiracy theory. It says your problems aren't your fault; it's immigrants, Black people, Jews.

Josh Bates: They talk about, oh, Hollywood and the media and all these Jews that are in these positions of power. When you google that kind of stuff and you see it and you consume it, eventually after a few months you kind of get desensitized to it. Everybody's agreeing with everyone for the most part. You get along. There's that online community. Stormfront was my first one.

Stan Alcorn: He didn't know their names, but they were his team now. He'd spend the next 10 years as what he calls a keyboard warrior for the white supremacist movement. He'd be there for every step in its evolution, from joining the KKK and the neo-Nazi National Socialist Movement to more diffuse groups and websites that called themselves alt-right and identitarian.

Stan Alcorn: Some of these groups would go to some lengths to appear respectable and say, "We're not racists. We're not Nazis. We're not the KKK." Then some of those groups were Nazis; they were the KKK. You were in all of them. Does that tell you that the differences between these groups are more about the image and the tactics than the core ideas or who they attract?

Josh Bates: Absolutely. We've been using the terms white nationalism 1.0 and white nationalism 2.0 for a few years now. 1.0 is your early groups, Ku Klux Klan. They're very explicit, National Socialist Movement, walking around with swastikas on their uniforms and their flags. Your 2.0 guys, they're your Identity Evropas, where they're dressing in khakis and collared shirts and dock shoes, and they've got these nice cropped haircuts. They call that good optics. But anybody who was in the early 1.0 movements like myself, I could see right through it. They just put lipstick on a pig. That's all they did.

Stan Alcorn: But people who followed the white supremacist movement for decades, like Type Investigations reporter David Neiwert, they say that this alt-right makeover of the old racist right, it was transformative.

David Neiwert: That radical right was very backward-looking, very stiff and formal. They didn't have any... Humor was not part of their repertoire. In fact, their primary recruitment demographic really was men between the ages of 40 and 60. With the advent of the alt-right, what we saw was this very tech-savvy, very agile movement that, instead of running away from the culturally savvy aspects of the internet, rather embraced them wholly.

Stan Alcorn: Instead of writing racist newsletters that people had to sign up for, they were making memes and jokes in places like Reddit and 4chan. These forums that celebrated being politically incorrect, they were the perfect place for those ideas to take root, hybridize with other fringe ideas, and grow into something that could be shared on more mainstream platforms like Twitter and Facebook.

David Neiwert: It was very brilliant because it meant that suddenly their recruitment demographic was much larger and had a lot more political activist energy. They were younger people.

Stan Alcorn: Josh Bates says that energy got a huge boost in 2016 with the rise of a new presidential candidate.

Donald Trump: They're bringing drugs. They're bringing crime. They're rapists. Some, I assume, are good people.

Josh Bates: Because Trump was spouting off a lot of the same talking points as general white nationalists, he breathed new life into that movement. The thought leaders of the movement just took full advantage, thinking that they could take it even further, and they did.

Stan Alcorn: They started to take their ideas into the real world.

Megan Squire: They were being emboldened by Trump and really acting out.

Stan Alcorn: After Trump's election in 2017, computer scientist Megan Squire set up software to track extremists on Facebook. She'd started out studying the misogynist Gamergate movement, but that had led her to all of these different anti-Muslim and neo-Confederate and white supremacist groups.

Megan Squire: At the time, Facebook was a central player, if not the central player, and it was the place where these guys all wanted to be. I was looking for ideological crossover, group membership crossover, just trying to, I guess, map the ecosystem of hate on Facebook.

Stan Alcorn: She watched this ecosystem plan what one neo-Nazi website would call the Summer of Hate, anti-Muslim marches, misogynist Proud Boy rallies, and what was shaping up to be this real-world meetup of all these different mostly online hate groups, the Unite the Right rally in Charlottesville, Virginia. This is where she came across Josh Bates.

Megan Squire: There was a person who was talking about they didn't have enough money to go to Charlottesville, and someone else suggested, "Hey, we have this crowdfunding site. Why don't you set up a fundraiser?"

Originally posted here:
The Evolution of All-American Terrorism - Reveal