Eric Holder: Snowden did public service by leaking secrets

NEW YORK DAILY NEWS

Monday, May 30, 2016, 12:37 PM

Former U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder thinks fugitive leaker Edward Snowden actually performed a "public service" when he passed on classified NSA secrets to journalists.

"We can certainly argue about the way in which Snowden did what he did, but I think that he actually performed a public service by raising the debate that we engaged in and by the changes that we made," Holder told David Axelrod on his CNN-produced podcast "The Axe Files."

Holder, who served as U.S. attorney general from 2009 to 2015 while Snowden was leaking top secret information, nevertheless maintained that the former contractor should face consequences.

"Now I would say that doing what he did and the way he did it was inappropriate and illegal," Holder said, adding that Snowden's actions "harmed American interests."

Oliver Stone reveals secret meetings with Edward Snowden

"I know there are ways in which certain of our agents were put at risk, relationships with other countries were harmed, our ability to keep the American people safe was compromised," he said.

"I think there has to be a consequence for what he has done," Holder added. "But, I think in deciding what an appropriate sentence should be, I think a judge could take into account the usefulness of having had that national debate."

Snowden said earlier this year that he would consider returning to the U.S. if he was granted a fair trial for his crimes.

After sparking global outrage in 2013 when he first began leaking classified information to journalists about the U.S. government's previously secret eavesdropping powers, the former NSA contractor took off for safer ground and was charged by the U.S. with espionage charges that could land him in prison for up to 30 years.

He first fled to Hong Kong, and then Moscow, where he has was granted permission to remain for at least three years.

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Eric Holder: Snowden did public service by leaking secrets ...

Eric Holder(Photo: Chris Kleponis, epa)

Fugitive former National Security Agency contractorEdward Snowden damaged U.S. interests but also performed a public service when he leaked national security documents in 2013, former U.S. attorney general Eric Holder said Monday.

Holder, in The Axe Filepodcasthosted by Democratic political operativeDavid Axelrod and distributed by CNN, said Snowden's exposure of global surveillance programs, some operated by the NSA,was "inappropriate and illegal." Holder said some agents were put in jeopardy and relationships with other nations were strained.

After Snowden's revelations, federal courts ruled against the NSA's mass collection of American phone records. Congress subsequently passed the USA Freedom Act, which limits the collection of such records.

"We can certainly argue about the way in which Snowden did what he did, but I think that he actually performed a public service by raising the debate that we engaged in and by the changes that we made," Holder said.

Snowden, who fled to Hong Kong and now lives inRussia, faces two counts of Espionage Act violations and one count of theft. He has said he would return to face those charges if he believed he would get a fair trial and would be allowed to use a "public interest" defense.

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Holder, the first black U.S. attorney general, served from 2009 to 2015. Hesaid Snowden should come back to face the consequences of his actions.

"Go to trial, try to cut a deal. I think there has to be a consequence for what he has done," Holder said. "ButI think ...a judge could take into account the usefulness of having had that national debate."

Snowden did not directly react to Holder's comments. Snowden did, however,retweet Glenn Greenwald, one of the journalists to whom he leaked information. Greenwaldposted: "People so often become honest and candid only once they leave government."

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Eric Holder gives props to Edward Snowden - usatoday.com

Edward Snowden.

Former US Attorney General Eric Holder has admitted that whistleblower Edward Snowden performed a "public service" by opening a debate about surveillance. However, speaking to David Axelrod of CNN and Chicago Institute of Politics podcast The Axe Files, he also said Snowden still needed to face penalties for what he did.

"We can certainly argue about the way in which Snowden did what he did, but I think that he actually performed a public service by raising the debate that we engaged in and by the changes that we made," he said. In a 2014 interview, he was much more hardline, saying that Snowden would have to plead guilty to even consider coming home.

He added, "He's broken the law in my view. He needs to get lawyers, come on back, and decide, see what he wants to do: Go to trial, try to cut a deal. I think there has to be a consequence for what he has done. But I think in deciding what an appropriate sentence should be, I think a judge could take into account the usefulness of having had that national debate." You can listen to the full episode here.

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Eric Holder: Edward Snowden performed a 'public service' - CNET

Eric Holder speaks at the Justice Department on March 4, 2015. Carolyn Kaster / AP, file

"We can certainly argue about the way in which Snowden did what he did, but I think that he actually performed a public service by raising the debate that we engaged in and by the changes that we made," Holder told former Obama White House adviser David Axelrod on an episode of

But the former attorney general was quick to add that Snowden who leaked explosive documents about American government surveillance programs while working as a contractor for the National Security Agency in 2013 acted in a way that was "inappropriate and illegal."

"I think he harmed American interests," Holder said. "I know there are ways in which certain of our agents were put at risk, relationships with other countries were harmed, our ability to keep the American people safe was compromised."

Holder called on Snowden, who has been living in exile in Moscow for the last three years, to come back to the United States to face the "consequence" of his actions.

"He's broken the law, in my view," Holder said. "He needs to get lawyers, come on back and ... see what he wants to do: Go to trial, try to cut a deal. I think there has to be a consequence for what he has done."

Holder added that a judge "could take into account the usefulness of having had that national debate" in deciding any "appropriate sentence" for Snowden.

Snowden claimed in an interview with the BBC late last year that he had "volunteered to go to prison with the (U.S.) government many times" but had not heard back from the American government.

The Department of Justice at the time would not confirm or deny that assertion.

The revelations contained in the material leaked by Snowden set off a national conversation about the give-and-take between national security and civilian privacy.

Holder served as attorney general from 2009 to 2015. He has since

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Eric Holder: Edward Snowden Performed 'Public Service'

"We can certainly argue about the way in which Snowden did what he did, but I think that he actually performed a public service by raising the debate that we engaged in and by the changes that we made," Holder told David Axelrod on "The Axe Files," a podcast produced by CNN and the University of Chicago Institute of Politics.

"Now I would say that doing what he did -- and the way he did it -- was inappropriate and illegal," Holder added.

"He harmed American interests," said Holder, who was at the helm of the Justice Department when Snowden leaked U.S. surveillance secrets. "I know there are ways in which certain of our agents were put at risk, relationships with other countries were harmed, our ability to keep the American people safe was compromised. There were all kinds of re-dos that had to be put in place as a result of what he did, and while those things were being done we were blind in certain really critical areas. So what he did was not without consequence."

Snowden, who has spent the last few years in exile in Russia, should return to the U.S. to deal with the consequences, Holder noted.

"I think that he's got to make a decision. He's broken the law in my view. He needs to get lawyers, come on back, and decide, see what he wants to do: Go to trial, try to cut a deal. I think there has to be a consequence for what he has done."

"But," Holder emphasized, "I think in deciding what an appropriate sentence should be, I think a judge could take into account the usefulness of having had that national debate."

At a University of Chicago Institute of Politics event earlier this month, Snowden -- appearing via videoconference from Russia -- said he would return to the U.S. if he could receive a fair trial.

"I've already said from the very first moment that if the government was willing to provide a fair trial, if I had access to public interest defenses and other things like that, I would want to come home and make my case to the jury," Snowden told University of Chicago Law Prof. Geoffrey Stone. "But, as I think you're quite familiar, the Espionage Act does not permit a public interest defense. You're not allowed to speak the word 'whistleblower' at trial."

White House Press Secretary Josh Earnest on Tuesday said President Barack Obama does not believe Snowden has performed a public service.

"What Mr. Holder is articulating there is the view of the administration, which is specifically that Mr. Snowden has been charged with serious crimes," Earnest said. "He should return to the United States, he should be afforded due process and that's essentially how this situation should be handled. But Mr. Snowden has not done so."

"I don't think there's any question about that," Holder told Axelrod. "The fact that he questioned the legitimacy of President Obama by questioning where he was born, what he's said about Mexicans...I think there's a race-based component to his campaign. I think he appeals too often to the worst side of us as Americans."

CNN's Allie Malloy contributed to this report.

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Eric Holder now says Edward Snowden performed 'public service ...

Edward Snowden appears on a live video feed broadcast from Moscow at a 2015 event. Photograph: Marco Garcia/AP

The former US attorney general Eric Holder has said the National Security Agency whistleblower Edward Snowden performed a public service by starting a debate over government surveillance techniques.

Related: How the Pentagon punished NSA whistleblowers | Mark Hertsgaard

Speaking on a podcast hosted by David Axelrod, a former campaign strategist for Barack Obama, Holder emphasized, however, that Snowden must still be punished.

We can certainly argue about the way in which Snowden did what he did, but I think that he actually performed a public service by raising the debate that we engaged in and by the changes that we made, Holder said, in an hourlong discussion on The Axe Files.

Now, I would say that doing what he did and the way he did it was inappropriate and illegal.

In June 2013, in one of the biggest document leaks in American history, Snowden revealed to media outlets including the Guardian that the NSA conducted indiscriminate bulk surveillance of US citizens. The agency said this mass data collection had been kept secret in order to protect Americans.

Holder, who led the justice department during the document leak, said Snowden harmed American interests by releasing the files.

I know there are ways in which certain of our agents were put at risk, relationships with other countries were harmed, our ability to keep the American people safe was compromised, Holder told Axelrod.

There were all kinds of re-dos that had to be put in place as a result of what he did, and while those things were being done, we were blind in certain really critical areas. So what he did was not without consequence.

Though Holder said Snowden should return to the US to face trial, he added that any judge who tried him should account for his contribution to the debate about mass surveillance.

I think in deciding what an appropriate sentence should be, I think a judge could take into account the usefulness of having had that national debate, Holder said.

I think that he actually performed a public service by raising the debate that we engaged in

Snowden has said repeatedly that he would return to the US if he could get a fair trial.

But, as I think youre quite familiar, the Espionage Act does not permit a public interest defense, Snowden told a University of Chicago event earlier this month. Youre not allowed to speak the word whistleblower at trial.

Snowden, who was a contractor for the NSA, has lived in Russia in the years following the leaks. Russia first granted him temporary asylum, then in 2014 gave him a three-year residency.

Snowden responded to Holders comments on Twitter on Monday night.

The frontrunners in the 2016 presidential race, Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump, have said Snowden should be punished, though they disagree in how serious that punishment should be.

In a Democratic debate in October, Clinton said Snowden should return and be put on trial. Bernie Sanders, now the only other Democratic contender, agreed, though he said he thought Snowden played a very important role in educating the American public.

In 2013, Trump implied that Snowden should be executed. In March, he said the US should get Snowden back from Russia because he is a spy. The Kremlin said it would not entertain such a plan.

Related: CIA ex-boss: secretive spooks tolerated in UK more than in US

Holder has shown some leniency toward Snowden before, but his use of the phrase public service turned heads.

In January 2014, Holder told an audience at the University of Virginia that the government could accept a plea deal with Snowden if he were to return to the US and plead guilty to criminal charges.

He reiterated the possibility of a plea deal last year, after stepping down from his post as the countrys top law enforcement officer in April 2015 and returning to private practice with the Washington law firm Covington & Burling.

I certainly think there could be a basis for a resolution that everybody could ultimately be satisfied with, Holder told Yahoo News in July 2015. He added that the disclosures spurred a necessary debate.

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Eric Holder says Edward Snowden performed 'public service ...

Former National Security Agency contractor Edward Snowden speaks via video conference at Johns Hopkins University in February. Juliet Linderman /AP hide caption

Former National Security Agency contractor Edward Snowden speaks via video conference at Johns Hopkins University in February.

Former Attorney General Eric Holder says Edward Snowden's leak was "inappropriate and illegal" but "I think that he actually performed a public service by raising the debate that we engaged in and by the changes that we made."

Holder, who was attorney general when Snowden leaked highly sensitive documents that detailed some of the work of the National Security Agency, made the comments in an interview with former Obama adviser David Axelrod.

Holder went on to say: "He harmed American interests. I know there are ways in which certain of our agents were put at risk, relationships with other countries were harmed, our ability to keep the American people safe was compromised. There were all kinds of re-dos that had to be put in place as a result of what he did, and while those things were being done we were blind in certain really critical areas. So what he did was not without consequence."

After leaking the documents to The Guardian and other publications, the former NSA contractor fled, ending up in Russia where he remains exiled.

In the past, Snowden has said he is willing to return to the U.S. if he is afforded a fair trial. Snowden is charged with espionage and theft.

Yesterday, Snowden tweeted:

In his interview, Holder also said that it's time for Snowden to make a decision.

"I think that he's got to make a decision," Holder said. "He's broken the law in my view. He needs to get lawyers, come on back, and decide, see what he wants to do: Go to trial, try to cut a deal. I think there has to be a consequence for what he has done."

Holder continued: "But I think in deciding what an appropriate sentence should be, I think a judge could take into account the usefulness of having had that national debate."

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Former AG Holder Says Edward Snowden's Leak Was A 'Public ...

President Obama doesnt agree with his former attorney general that classified-info leaker Edward Snowden performed a public service when he leaked classified data to the media.

The president has had the opportunity to speak on this a number of times, and I think a careful review of his public comments would indicate that he does not, White House spokesman Josh Earnest said Tuesday of whether Obama shared ex-AG Eric Holders view of Snowden.

His statement came a day after Holder said during the podcast The Axe Files that the debate over secrecy and privacy sparked by the Snowden case was a positive development.

Hes broken the law, in my view. He needs to get lawyers, come on back and decide, see what he wants to do: go to trial, try to cut a deal, Holder told former Obama aide David Axelrod.

He added, I think there has to be a consequence for what he has done. We can certainly argue about the way in which Snowden did what he did, but I think that he actually performed a public service by raising the debate that we engaged in and by the changes that we made.

Earnest said Obama would agree with much of that sentiment but would not characterize Snowdens alleged crimes as a public service.

I would point out that even Mr. Holder pointed out in that interview that Hes broken the law, in my view, Earnest said.

Snowden, 32, turned to Twitter to mockingly compare the evolving schools of thought on his leak.

2013: Its treason! 2014: Maybe not, but it was reckless 2015: Still, technically it was unlawful 2016: It was a public service but, he wrote.

Snowden leaked classified information as a contractor for the National Security Agency in 2013.

He fled to Hong Kong and then Russia, where he lives under the protection of strongman Vladimir Putin.

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