Ava DuVernay has been up until 12:30 a.m. shooting A Wrinkle in Time for Disney, but the director of Selma is enthused to finally talk about the Oscar-nominated documentary 13th.

The former publicist is the first woman of color to direct a live-action film with a production budget of more than $100 million. Last fall, she premiered her first television show, the well-received Queen Sugar, which aired on the Oprah Winfrey Network.

So DuVernay hasnt much time to discuss her powerful documentary released in October which is up for Oscar and BAFTA awards.

13th takes its title from the amendment that outlawed slavery in 1865, though with the caveat except as a punishment for a crime.

The documentary, available on Netflix, examines how that clause has led to a mass-incarceration system that disproportionately imprisons African-American men. In many of the for-profit institutions, inmates are then used as cheap labor, employed for pennies by major companies, creating a de facto form of slavery.

A note here: DuVernay and I were phone acquaintances in her PR days, although we never met. So it was a pleasure to finally meet her in person. What follows is an edited version of our conversation about 13, and what led her to do the film, including an emotional story from when she grew up in Compton.

Q Has the film been getting the response you were hoping for?

A I have been shocked. I really didnt think it would have this much attention, and I did not think that people react to it as emotionally as they have. It is an intimate topic. It is really about the way that we think about race in this country, regardless of who you are and how we engage with each other and what our belief system is. There are some things in this doc that challenge what we believed or even thought we knew. Its a little disconcerting when we realize what we dont know. I thought it would sit on Netflix as a resource for teachers. I really didnt think it would cross into a cultural zeitgeist kind of thing.

Q Are you getting response from legislators?

A Yes, as a teaching tool like Congressman John Lewis and Sen. Cory Booker. Those people are using it as an entry point to talk to their communities and constituents. I havent heard about any pushback from the other side. Havent heard anything from anyone on the right or any conservatives. Its been oddly quiet.

Q When you made this, it was before the presidential election and reforms were being pushed; now with President Trump in the White House, the film is more relevant than ever.

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A Stock in private prisons shot up the day after his election. The executive orders that hes signing signal his intention to bolster policies and practices that favor those who profit off of the least of us. Prisons are clearly in the bulls-eye for this. The deregulation through executive is moving to a place that will undo a lot of work that has been done by a bipartisan coalition taking steps toward reform.

Q What can be done?

A Its important that people continue to assert what they believe. I believe in the power people have and the power in the protest. That isnt just pie in the sky stuff. Three years ago, the Black Lives matter movement was happening and people thought this is a moment, but there has been a concerted, concentrated effort with deliberate action that has not stopped since that day. The Civil Rights Movement at its height was over 10 years. In the two weeks of Trumps presidency, weve seen spontaneous protests at airports and huge numbers at the womens marches all around the country expressing their dissent. Its going to be more crucial now than ever to continue do that, and for artists to continue to promote that and do what we can to amplify it.

Q How did you come to the project?

A I was an African American studies major at UCLA. We were encouraged to do a deep dive into the Constitution, and it has just kind of been putting together the pieces from there understanding there is a direct correlation between that clause and the mass incarceration that were experiencing now. At first, I hadnt done the research to connect the dots, but with some 2.3 million people behind bars it seemed there was something to that. So I began tracing and tracking it and really being able to get down to the kind of granular policies legislation signed that actually perpetuated it. It was important to break down the images of the war on drugs and what was perpetuated by the media. So the assignment for myself was to focus on prison for profit, the way that many companies are profiting on punishment.

Q You reached out to conservatives in the documentary, like Newt Gingrich.

A I know what I think, but it was important to reach out to Republicans and Democrats and liberals. I wanted this to be a conversation like a master class from people of all walks of life. Sometimes we learn from people who dont think anything like us.

Q Youve been pretty busy.

A These films are my children. I dont have kids, and Im not going to have kids. So this is what Im leaving behind. But for this film, I havent had a chance to go out there and beat the drum for it.

Q It seems like everyone in the black community Ive talked to feel connected to this film because of things that happened in their lives.

A Growing up in Compton, police aggression and issues of incarceration were all around. I have a very, very small family. So theres no one in my direct family involved, but when every black man you know has a police story, a lot of the people have been directly touched by it. I tell this story on this Netflix special I did with Oprah about my father being tackled in our backyard in Compton because the police were running through peoples backyards looking for someone else. My father was in the backyard watering the grass. Hes a very dignified man a beautiful, beautiful man. He was tackled to the ground like a criminal, handcuffed in front of his family, cursed at I saw all this berated and belittled because they thought he was a criminal. They had no respect for his property a man in his own backyard and they couldnt hear his protests. These are the kinds of incidences that many people of color in this country are scarred with, and so when I watch 13th, it has a particular vibe to it for me.

Originally posted here:

Ava DuVernay's Oscar-nominated '13th' documentary aims to unlock the truth - The Pasadena Star-News