This story about Sandra Hller first appeared in theRace Begins issueof TheWrap magazine.
Justine Triet has a word for Sandra Hller, her star in the dark family drama Anatomy of a Fall, which won the Palme dOr at this years Cannes Film Festival: ungraspable.
It is a word in English that I didnt know before yesterday, she said in early October. And now I want to use it all the time, forSandra.
The word certainly applies to Hllers character in Anatomy of a Fall, in which she plays a successful writer (also named Sandra) who is accused of murdering her husband. Triet never tips her hand to reveal whether Sandra is innocent or guilty, with Hller finding a way to suggest both alternatives at the same time as the thorny film swings between a portrait of a fracturing relationship and a charged courtroom drama.
But Anatomy isnt the only powerful project that Hller is in this year; its not even the only one that premiered in Cannes in May. The German actress is also one of the leads inJonathan Glazers The Zone of Interest, a dispassionate and chilling examination of a Nazi family that lives in a bucolic house just outside the gates of Auschwitz, where the father, Rudolph Hss, is in charge of the mass extermination of Jews. Hllers Hedwig Hss is a woman who loves her lifestyle and to all appearances doesnt give a thought to whats happening on the other side of that wall. Shes hard to understand, but more than that, impossible to find sympathetic.
The two films are a study in contrasts: Anatomy urgent, talky and in-your-face, with Hllers character pleading her case through much of the action; Zone all about distances, with the camera backing off from these awful people who want to live normal lives unshadowed by their monstrous deeds.You could say that both characters are ungraspable, and Hller would probably agree but when Triet used the word, she made it clear that she applied it not to Sandra the character but to Sandra the actress.
In conversation, theres something elusive about Hller. The 45-year-old, who was born inSuhl when it was part of East Germany, is friendly but a little hesitant; shes said that she admires actors who can spin anecdotes and charm interviewers, but theres also a sense that she doesnt do that partly because English isnt her first language (German is) but also because she chooses not to.
The first time TheWrap interviewed her, at a screening of Toni Erdmann in 2016, she was enjoying a breakthrough with that Oscar-nominated film after a career that had begun on the stage and then included a string of films that didnt get much exposure outside of Europe. At that Q&A, I brought up a story that director Maren Ade had told me about how, during rehearsals for the movies uproarious naked dinner party scene, Hller opened the door nude to give a late-arriving actor a start. At the screening, Hller said she didnt know what I was talking about, that it had never happened but when I saw her again a week later, she apologized profusely and said shed misunderstood me and the story was true. When I reminded her of our earlier encounter when we met for this story, she said she didnt remember that and wouldnt have answered the door naked, but maybe she did so in her underwear.
So who is Sandra Hller? Shes gifted, private and, yes, ungraspable but shes also made a big and bold mark on cinema in 2023, when she became the first actor ever to star in Cannes Palme dOr winner (Anatomy of a Fall) and its Grand Prix winner (The Zone of Interest). She speaks three languages in those two films English and French in Anatomy and German in Zone and she also appeared at this years Berlin Film Festival as one of the stars of Sisi & I, a historical black comedy in which Hller plays 19th-century countess Irma Sztray, who became a handmaiden to Empress Elisabeth of Austria (Susanne Wolff), also known as Sisi. (The 2022 film Corsage, shot at the same time, was another revisionist and feminist film about that monarch.)
It is what it is, she said matter-of-factly of having Anatomy and Zone simultaneously stirring up awards buzz. Its a great blessing that they are both running at the same time and that I can find out so many more things about my work and what people think about it. To me, it feels like a gift.
Like many other things these days, you can thank the COVID-19 pandemic for the Hller logjam this awards season. The Zone of Interest was originally scheduled to shoot in 2020 but was delayed to 2021 because of the pandemic, giving her only six weeks off before she began shooting Sisi & Me. When that film ended, she had about three months before Anatomy of a Fall began production, though she was also taking lessons to improve her French before that film.
I like to have a lot of free time between works, she said. I like the time to settle and to reconnect with the life Im living, because shooting can be very intense. Theres a whole thing that goes on with the body hormone-wise when youre working adrenaline and dopamine and all these things that you cant live with every day or youd go crazy. I need some time to get it out of my body. A shrug. But sometimes, you cant do that.
The Holocaust movie, oddly, was both the most difficult one to do and the one that took the least out of her. I didnt feel like getting into character while working on The Zone of Interest, she said. I usually tend to be more empathetic with the characters to love them more, to give them more of my fantasies and more of myself. With Hedwig, it felt wrong to give her anything from me. So I was just watching her and doing what Jonathan told me.
She was encouraged by the way Glazer shot the film, with cameras set up in the corner of rooms in the house where the Hss family lived, and with the film crew watching from the basement rather than sharing the rooms with the actors. Jonathan just wanted to show the life of the people with death next to them, caused by them, she said. He didnt want to have any heroism, or to have actors wondering which side would be the best to show, and wheres the light and wheres my mark and all this technical stuff. The topic is so much bigger than these technical questions.
She shook her head. I would never have done the movie if it had been a biopic about the Hsses. I never wanted to be part of this world.
And even though the story is being told by a British director, Hller felt compelled to be careful with the material because of her nationality. Doing this as a German, with my ancestors being responsible for all this, is something that I cannot deny, she said. The people in my country have the responsibility to keep talking about this, even if some of them deny it. The responsibility not to make it be forgotten and not to let it happen again.
This was something that happened to the world where time really stopped. It changed the world completely. We were wondering so many times what the world would be like now if this hadnt happened. And we cant even imagine it. It had such a big impact that you cannot treat it like every other movie, and I cannot treat the character like every other character.
After finishing work on Zone, Hller used the Sisi & I shoot to wash Hedwig out of her system. Irma is the complete opposite of Hedwig, she said. Shes a very childlike, non-judgmental, kind person. I was thinking about that when I accepted both roles, that Irma would come after Hedwig and wipe her out.
Shifting to Anatomy of a Fall after Sisi, she said, was more a case of getting back to her usual way of working. Triet had written the script (with Arthur Harari) with
Hller in mind for the character of the woman who always leaves us questioning her motives and actions. I was obsessed by her, the writer-director said. I dont always know if its the best to write for an actress, but she was very (much) in our mind during the writing. Just thinking about Sandra helped us create a more realistic character.
In one way, the films biggest complication for Hller was the language: The character speaks English to her husband and son, but shes required to speak French, in which the actress is less fluent, in the courtroom. The question that dominates the film is set up in the first few scenes, when Sandras husband, Samuel (Samuel Theis), either falls, jumps or is pushed to his death from the top floor of the couples French mountain chalet. We gradually learn that Sandra has lied about certain aspects of their relationship, but we never know whether she killed him. And Hller never knew, either.
I was captivated when (Justine) sent me the script, she said. Id never read anything like this about the division of power between modern couples, and I wanted to find out if she did it. I really wanted Justines thoughts on this, but she never did tell me. But we found out quickly that it doesnt really matter. Its more about what we think of the character and about our own limits and moral boundaries. Can we deal with a woman who doesnt feel shame? It was not if she did it or not, it was the way she was treated as a human being in this trial.
On the other hand, having an answer would have given Hller a clearer idea of how to play Sandra, right? Yeah, she said. It wouldve made it so much easier for me. But I can defend this character no matter what she had or hadnt done. In the end, she gave Triet different takes to fit whatever interpretation the director wanted. And more recently, Hller even got a promise from the director: She told me two days ago that she will tell me if Sandra did it in 10 years. But not before.
By that point, Hller may well be better known in the United States: With the one-two punch of Anatomy and Zone, which are being released in the U.S. by Neon and A24, respectively, it makes sense that she may be getting interest from Hollywood. On the other hand, that shouldhave happened seven years ago after Toni Erdmann, but she said it didnt.
I dont have a crystal ball, so I really dont know if they are interested in me now, she said. Also, I dont know what kind of direction that would go. I can do some things, but there are some things I certainly cannot do like superhero stuff, I just couldnt. I would probably burst out laughing all the time.
But after emerging from the COVID shutdown with a blast of three movies and lots of Oscar buzz, does she have a sense of where she wants to go next? Have her priorities changed? Theyve changed because time has passed and Im a bit older, she said. When I was a teenager, I never had any special interests, hobbies or sports. And then my English and German teacher opened a drama club in my school when I was 14 or 15 and it was so much fun more fun than I had ever found in doing anything else. Now, COVID has shown me how fragile the system is and how fast things can just go away or be postponed. It showed me how precious it is to be able to do this.
Im curious what comes from this. But Im really, really happy that I have this experience and even if nothing happens, I cannot be disappointed. I would just go on living my life.
Read more from the Race Begins issue here.
Read more here:
'Anatomy of a Fall' and 'Zone of Interest' Star Sandra Hller Explores Shades of Darkness - TheWrap
